Disability Rights: Equal Access After a Disaster

Tune in to our Disability Rights podcast. This episode covers what a volunteer attorney needs to know to represent clients with disabilities effectively and make sure they received equal access to disaster resources.

Guest Speakers: Stephanie Duke and Rachel Cohen-Miller from Disability Rights Texas  

Visit our website at https://texasdisasterlegalhelp.org/

Music Credit:
Track: Travel With Us — Vendredi [Audio Library Release]
Music provided by Audio Library Plus Watch: https://youtu.be/o-rpKzt4KSY Free Download / Stream: https://alplus.io/travel-us

Transcript

Transcript

00:03

so hello folks another installment here

00:05

about podcasts with texas disaster legal

00:07

help

00:08

a project of the three legal aid

00:09

programs in texas and today we've got a

00:11

great uh

00:12

podcast we're going to be recording and

00:14

belinda's going to introduce you all the

00:15

speakers in a few seconds but let me go

00:16

ahead and just kind of mention real

00:17

quick as i do at the beginning of every

00:19

podcast

00:20

uh what this project is all about my

00:22

name is pablo almaguer

00:23

i work at texas rio grande legal aid

00:26

and this project itself is

00:27

a coordinated project between legal aid

00:29

of northwest texas lone star legal aid

00:31

and trla it's aimed at improving access

00:34

to justice for those affected by

00:35

disasters our project allows both

00:37

disaster survivors and pro bono

00:38

attorneys to access critical resources

00:40

in one place

00:41

while at the same time making it easier

00:42

to connect disaster survivors needing

00:44

help

00:44

legal help with volunteer attorneys

00:46

willing to provide it

00:47

in this way the project team hopes to

00:49

increase the number of disaster survivor

00:51

clients who receive high quality legal

00:52

assistance

00:53

as they continue to navigate the

00:54

recovery process after disaster

00:56

and provide the support and mentorship

00:58

pro bono attorneys need to achieve this

01:00

success

01:01

my co-hosts here are belinda martinez from

01:03

lone star legal aid and stuart campbell

01:06

from legal aid of northwest texas let me

01:08

go ahead and turn over to belinda so we

01:10

can start the introduction of our

01:11

speakers and get into the

01:12

subject matter thank you pablo

01:16

today's episode covers what a volunteer

01:18

attorney needs to know to represent

01:20

disabled clients effectively

01:22

there is a cross-section of legal aid

01:24

clients that are disabled and like

01:25

low-income clients disabled clients are

01:27

also underserved

01:28

and just simply don't have equal access

01:30

to the resources

01:32

to speak more on the subject we have

01:34

guest speakers

01:35

stephanie duke and rachel cohen-miller

01:38

stephanie duke is a staff attorney and

01:40

equal justice works disaster fellow at

01:42

disability rights texas

01:44

a member of the aba young lawyers

01:46

division disaster legal services team

01:48

and a commission appointment to texas

01:50

tax force on disaster issues affecting

01:52

elderly persons and persons

01:54

with disabilities since hurricane harvey

01:56

stephanie has been representing clients

01:58

with disabilities who have been denied

01:59

the benefit of

02:00

or face discriminatory practice in

02:02

disaster services

02:05

rachel cohen miller is the supervising

02:07

attorney of the housing transportation

02:08

disaster team for disability

02:10

disability rights texas the federally

02:13

designated legal and protection advocacy

02:14

organization for persons with

02:16

disabilities in texas

02:18

rachel works with the staff of the htd

02:20

team

02:21

here at texas teams and persons with

02:24

disabilities and community partners

02:25

using creative strategies in outreach

02:27

education advocacy and litigation to

02:29

address individual instances of

02:31

discrimination

02:32

as well as the systematic

02:33

institutionalized discrimination in her

02:36

free time with her friends and family

02:38

rachel is an avid soap maker and i've

02:40

been told enjoys playing with her lye

02:43

thank you for joining us

02:46

i don't even know what that means

02:51

let it sit i guess okay well let's go 

02:54

ahead and get into it

02:55

all right first things first broad topic

02:59

how do attorneys ensure the same level

03:01

of advocacy for disaster survivors with

03:03

disabilities

03:08

uh this is stephanie i'll take that

03:12

uh first understanding that they you

03:14

know the disability doesn't define

03:16

someone there are people first

03:18

so using people first language and

03:20

communicating with them to figure out if

03:22

they need accommodations to

03:25

effectively communicate or even just

03:27

develop that relationship between the

03:29

attorney

03:30

and client

03:37

and what would you add to that rachel

03:40

so i think that it's you know to kind of

03:42

build off of what stephanie said i think

03:44

that

03:45

one of the most important things to

03:46

remember is that people with

03:47

disabilities are

03:48

people too right and so um this is not

03:52

something you know people to keep at arms

03:54

length this is your neighbor this is

03:55

your mom this is your sister your son

03:57

um and so just remember that it's not

04:00

necessarily something

04:02

um that's got to be you know so scary to

04:06

um to do

04:11

and so as you all know um folks this

04:14

podcast is geared towards disaster

04:16

resistance recovery and our pro bono

04:18

volunteers to do those cases

04:19

and we've talked in other topics how

04:23

as frequently as we get disasters in

04:25

texas you see like some folks actually

04:27

becoming experts and you discover

04:29

in disaster recovery um that's more hit

04:32

us and i'm wondering for you all

04:35

if you've developed or identified issues

04:37

that otherwise wouldn't have been

04:38

identified that the vulnerable

04:40

population you'll assist

04:42

uh maybe was those of us that the system

04:45

weren't aware of you know as disasters

04:47

came about and

04:48

we experienced that then we learned to

04:50

be a better advocate for it

04:52

is that the case for disaster recovery

04:54

that you learn to identify some issues

04:55

that maybe a few years ago we didn't

04:56

realize

04:58

sure yeah i mean there's there's

05:00

definitely been a good number of things

05:02

like that that we've

05:04

we've figured out i mean a lot of the

05:06

things that we're seeing and this is

05:07

something we'll talk about

05:08

here in a few minutes i mean you've got

05:09

evictions that can potentially be

05:12

avoided with using reasonable

05:13

accommodations which is a legal

05:15

mechanism

05:16

and so you know before we started

05:20

using that nobody really thought of of

05:21

that as a tool to use to try to work

05:23

with a landlord to avoid an eviction to

05:26

stop it

05:26

right um but

05:29

now that's another tool in the toolbox

05:32

to see if we can't work with you know

05:34

can't work with landlords to to keep

05:36

people housed and to

05:38

ensure that you know

05:41

things go hopefully the way you know the

05:43

best what they can

05:45

um and it's been something that we've

05:47

been able you know getting

05:48

accommodations for clients

05:49

after a disaster whether it's you know

05:51

something related to covid or even

05:54

we've seen things come up as recently um

05:58

also relating to the winter storm last

05:59

month

06:01

and so it takes an attorney two three

06:03

hours total

06:05

to work something out where the client

06:07

doesn't isn't evicted gets to stay in

06:08

their home

06:09

and otherwise maybe they'd end up

06:11

homeless or sick or in a nursing home

06:13

and so it's it's doable and it's

06:17

certainly something we didn't see before

06:20

or we weren't thinking of before this

06:25

and in a disaster or rather after right

06:28

after a disaster

06:29

uh what are the most immediate needs for

06:31

individuals with disabilities

06:32

that pro bonos would see

06:34

06:36

uh this is stephanie so i think you know

06:38

rachel hit on housing's going to be the

06:40

first

06:41

immediate thing um and safe

06:44

housing at that so you know with covid

06:48

that obviously disaster is a little bit

06:50

different but when we're talking about

06:51

hurricanes and flood wildfires you know

06:53

people are displaced from their homes

06:55

so whether they're getting transitional

06:56

housing through fema

06:58

or if they're you know already public

07:00

housing tenants there are obligations to

07:03

ensure

07:03

they have safe accessible housing

07:07

to provide them in that interim and

07:09

figuring out you know permanent housing

07:11

plans

07:13

and that

07:16

stuff that especially you know if it's

07:19

there's some kind of subsidy which a lot

07:21

of our clients and i know legal aids

07:22

clients have

07:23

that's relatively simple to do um

07:27

you know include reaching out to the

07:28

either the housing authority or the

07:29

landlord and saying hey

07:31

we know you get these federal funds here

07:33

are the strings that are attached here's

07:34

what you gotta do

07:36

let's uh make this happen um

07:39

and generally it all it takes is that

07:42

um if it takes a little more maybe you

07:44

reach out to hud because there are local

07:46

folks here in texas

07:47

um and then things move along pretty

07:50

quickly too but

07:51

um that's another example of something

07:54

that you know that pro bono attorney

07:56

could do relatively easily easily and

07:58

quickly

08:01

i think it cut off a little bit in the

08:02

beginning i'm sorry but i think you're

08:04

On mute but it took it off a little bit

08:05

in the beginning you're talking about

08:07

i guess subsidies and benefits the

08:11

clients are getting rachel is that what

08:12

you were talking about

08:13

yeah so if if clients are are living in

08:16

housing that's assisted so if there's

08:18

either it's a housing authority or

08:20

there's some kind of hud money that runs

08:22

to it

08:22

there's a lot of obligations that

08:25

the property and you know the government

08:28

has the local authority has

08:30

um to make sure that people are housed

08:33

and so that's generally as easy as a

08:36

phone call

08:38

you know our experience has also been

08:39

that we're um those of uh trla you know

08:41

with several different kind of areas

08:43

especially housing that uh you know the

08:45

landlords are going through the same

08:46

issues as

08:47

the tenants are with disaster recovery

08:50

and that uh

08:51

especially even during this covid you

08:53

know pandemic

08:55

that an attempt to try to at least get

08:57

some benefits for the client so they can

08:59

pay for their rent which

09:00

might be available at the local state or

09:02

even federal level

09:04

it's always accepted i mean um

09:06

appreciated by the landlords and so it's

09:08

not always litigation that we do

09:09

sometimes we look for these resources to

09:10

connect the clients you know to those so

09:12

they can actually pay and everybody be

09:14

a win-win situation you'll see that a

09:15

lot happening in your services when you

09:17

help clients

09:20

yeah i think especially right now i mean

09:23

you know a lot of what

09:24

we've been working out is getting more

09:26

time for clients to pay because you know

09:29

there is help coming right there's

09:31

there's money that is coming

09:32

that's coming out of you know whether

09:34

it's local governments or the state

09:36

um so folks will be able to pay their

09:38

rent they just need a little bit more

09:40

time

09:41

um and so that's a lot of what you know

09:43

what this is is it's

09:45

either connecting them with you know

09:46

here are the resources here the places

09:48

you can go

09:49

um but also letting the landlord know

09:51

hey

09:52

you know client is working with you know

09:56

these entities to try to get you paid um

10:00

even if you are to kick them out i mean

10:02

the reality is who's going to move in

10:04

who's got money to rent this after our

10:05

client's gone

10:09

 so it sounds like

10:13

for the most part disaster survivors

10:16

encounter the same

10:17

legal issues as any other disaster

10:19

survivor

10:21

with just a little wrinkle of

10:24

unfortunately the client's disability

10:26

what would be some tips on issue

10:28

spotting

10:29

disability related issues or

10:31

discrimination in those cases

10:35

i would start with making sure they have

10:38

access to whether it's

10:40

it's not just getting in the building

10:42

it's what's in the building that you

10:44

should have access to as well so

10:45

systemic issues

10:46

you know fema's process is cumbersome

10:49

for anyone

10:50

but knowing what accommodations to ask

10:53

for depending on the need

10:55

is not always transparent so you know

10:59

they

10:59

if you have sensory impairments just

11:01

completing the application

11:02

and of itself is a barrier and then

11:05

on top of that the eligibility process

11:07

making sure

11:08

there are ways to modify practices

11:12

that would ensure your equal opportunity

11:14

to hopefully benefit from fema services

11:17

so it's not just

11:18

you know like i said architectural

11:20

access it's making sure that all these

11:21

disaster services

11:23

or whoever's providing assistance is

11:25

aware

11:26

of the systemic issues that can also be

11:28

in place

11:30

so i'd like to kind of back up and ask

11:33

like the

11:34

the why and why now questions so like

11:36

we've just had this

11:37

crazy we're recording in uh the middle

11:39

of march and we just had this crazy

11:40

winter storm

11:40

right uh i want to

11:45

ask both of you everyone is affected by

11:48

the natural disasters at least the most

11:50

recent one in texas the entire state was

11:52

but

11:53

of course throughout any given uh

11:55

hurricane season

11:56

there's a risk for a good chunk of the

11:58

state to be affected by

12:00

natural disasters what challenges do

12:03

individual individuals with disabilities

12:05

face

12:06

that someone who is not disabled will

12:09

face during a natural disaster

12:10

and if you could give us some some

12:12

examples a lot of us don't even

12:14

even practitioners in this field maybe

12:16

don't recognize some of the challenges

12:18

that they might be able

12:19

that they are facing as opposed to

12:21

someone who's not disabled and so

12:23

could you kind of point out some the why

12:25

and

12:26

the why it's really important right now

12:31

so i think a couple of things to keep in

12:34

mind here i think one of them that

12:36

you know that we've got to keep in mind

12:37

is we're in the middle of a pandemic you

12:39

know like he said it's march we're a

12:40

year into this thing

12:42

um people have been at home working from

12:44

home

12:45

or whether they're going to work life

12:47

has changed

12:48

drastically for everyone so there's you

12:51

know depression that a balance ptsd

12:53

anxiety all of that right certainly my

12:55

meds have increased since this thing

12:56

started

12:58

um and i certainly i'm not alone right

13:01

um and so i think that's one of the big

13:04

things to take into account right

13:06

so like if last month we had the storm

13:09

come through

13:10

and my area lost power we didn't have

13:12

rolling blackouts we are

13:14

rolling power outages we just had ever

13:16

they just turned us off

13:17

right we were one of those lucky areas

13:19

that doesn't have money

13:20

that they decided sorry you lose um

13:25

and everybody was already on edge right

13:27

because at that point you're almost a

13:29

year into covid everybody's been home

13:31

you know there there had already been

13:33

runs on grocery stores and things like

13:35

that and so

13:36

losing power and worrying about your

13:38

kids and worrying about your family

13:40

um it is stressing all of the things

13:44

that are already there

13:45

right so if i'm having to to try to talk

13:47

to fema

13:48

right and this is just me personally

13:50

knowing myself and the way

13:52

um my

13:55

you know my anxiety and ptsd and that

13:57

kind of stuff the way that

13:59

manifests for me if i'm trying to reach

14:02

out to to fema or somebody to get help

14:04

and and i'm not getting anywhere

14:08

my anxiety is getting worse it's

14:09

ratcheting up right and so

14:12

so what am i going to do right i may

14:14

give up we've had that happen

14:16

a lot right clients just give up they

14:17

don't call back right because

14:19

what is you know i'm never going to get

14:20

through to anybody anyway well in that

14:23

situation

14:24

what i could potentially do is say hey i

14:27

you know i need an accommodation let me

14:28

communicate with you another way whether

14:30

it's email or

14:31

text or i i i cannot you know waiting on

14:34

this phone is not going to work for me

14:36

i'm not

14:37

going to have access to that like

14:38

somebody else would doesn't have the

14:40

anxiety and the ptsd and

14:41

you know the other things that i'm

14:43

dealing with right and so

14:45

you know just put me on a level playing

14:46

field with everybody else

14:49

um and and it's things like that right

14:51

that's the

14:53

you know the on the ground what else are

14:56

we seeing

14:56

or that's one of them anyway

15:00

and i think you know a lot of times

15:03

in responding to disasters it's

15:07

it's contingent upon how we prepared for

15:09

it so

15:10

if you don't know what your resources

15:13

are beforehand

15:14

trying to figure it out after the fact

15:16

is just going to exacerbate anything

15:18

that

15:18

in someone's going through right it's

15:19

already traumatic to begin with

15:21

so and that comes back to

15:24

asking those questions you know if

15:26

there's going to be in a hurricane

15:28

points of evacuation who do you call to

15:30

find out when those decisions are made

15:32

or if it's after the fact points of

15:34

distribution for food

15:36

water like we saw in uri who's making

15:38

those decisions and who's making it

15:40

accessible

15:41

so it's knowing who's supposed to do

15:44

what and asking those questions

15:46

beforehand that's going to help mitigate

15:49

the need afterwards you know it's

15:52

interesting you mentioned that because

15:54

i'm

15:54

right now again in the middle of march

15:56

right we're starting to see i think some

15:57

states in some areas going to the 1c

15:59

classification for vaccinations now

16:01

uh and maybe our clients in our

16:03

population have made up to 181 b

16:06

but i wonder if now then our work will

16:09

require not only recovery from the

16:11

disaster

16:12

immediately we might be in the ice storm

16:14

but then a discussion on how to get that

16:16

vaccination to

16:17

access to it and to help our clients

16:19

because that's the longer

16:20

kind of long-term issue that they're

16:22

dealing with here and and to take

16:24

i mean one listing to have to worry

16:25

about as you try to do with your legal

16:27

problem

16:27

i didn't think about that until i i

16:29

heard you all and i talked about these

16:30

issues

16:31

then maybe i should add that now to my

16:32

considerations for my clients you know

16:34

are you vaccinated have you found

16:35

resources for that

16:37

maybe we can help you with that you know

16:38

because we have a few you know access or

16:41

points or other things to add here so

16:44

and

16:44

to to build off of that and i'm i'm up

16:46

in denton area

16:47

right and one of the things that we have

16:49

had you know i i've been real impressed

16:51

with the way

16:53

um obviously you know we've been having

16:55

this we've got this mass vaccination

16:57

site

16:58

over at the texas motor speedway and

17:01

you know what do you do when somebody

17:03

doesn't have a way over right

17:05

over there right because the disability

17:06

they can't get over there

17:08

well what they've started to do is

17:09

they've started to provide

17:10

transportation now

17:12

so we have now there is now a way for

17:15

people to get over there and that's one

17:17

of these issues that again i think that

17:18

even

17:19

you know we're talking about you know

17:21

pro bono attorney if if this is brought

17:23

up to a pro bono attorney and certainly

17:24

you know stephanie's always here i'm

17:26

always here reach out to us you know you

17:27

got questions that's what we're here for

17:29

always you know um but

17:33

one of the things that can be done

17:34

especially and this is actually probably

17:36

better done by local attorneys than by

17:38

us because local attorneys have these

17:39

ins like you know who the judges are

17:41

you can call somebody and be like hey we

17:43

got this issue

17:44

let's all work together to solve it

17:46

right let's get transportation worked

17:47

out for people

17:49

you know so the people with disabilities

17:50

can get to this site or you know because

17:52

it's a drive-through

17:53

my client can't drive a car right what

17:55

do we do then

17:56

well initially it's your client can't

17:58

get vaccinated well that's not the right

18:00

answer

18:01

um and again a local attorney that's got

18:03

ties with folks in the community can

18:05

call and say hey

18:07

uh nah this isn't the way this works

18:09

right and so it's

18:10

it's very much a yes it's a legal issue

18:14

but with a local attorney it could be a

18:15

very short

18:17

thing to solve because they've got the

18:18

connections there in these small

18:21

in small community small towns that we

18:22

don't have

18:24

um and so that's something that

18:25

potentially

18:27

could be really really beneficial um

18:30

and quite frankly you know we've all

18:33

been been hometown i mean it's it's

18:35

better than us trying to do it

18:38

exactly we've uh i think on several uh

18:41

episodes have mentioned

18:43

one of the things about representing

18:45

disaster clients is

18:46

they're coming in for one issue but more

18:49

than likely they probably have five or

18:50

six others they don't even know about

18:51

until you start talking to them

18:53

and one of the things that we always

18:55

make sure on the texas disaster legal

18:57

help website is make sure

18:59

we do have lists of those local

19:01

resources that if you are

19:03

transactional attorney or you know this

19:06

is just not your field at all

19:08

you can give the client that information

19:11

another example i always use

19:12

is like you said if there's no food and

19:15

their electricity is out

19:17

they're not really caring about their

19:18

fema application right at that second

19:21

they need to eat and they need light and

19:22

power and there

19:24

you need to be able to point them to

19:25

those resources even though technically

19:27

that's not

19:28

generally in the sphere of

19:31

representation normally um

19:35

so thank you for mentioning that it's

19:37

always something to keep in the back of

19:39

your mind

19:41

uh one of the other questions i want to

19:43

ask is

19:45

going back to pro bono volunteers just

19:47

what are some of the types of cases they

19:48

see we touched on

19:49

housing and that's usually a major one

19:51

but what are some of the other issues

19:52

that seems to come up

19:55

so recently and this again disaster is

19:58

ever evolving right stephanie said we're

20:00

always going to have

20:02

the the you know weather-related

20:04

disasters but we're seeing more and more

20:07

different disasters now right so one of

20:10

the things we're looking at and taking a

20:12

look into a deep dive into is

20:14

infrastructure

20:16

right so power people that need

20:19

power at their house well if it's like

20:21

my area where they decided to just

20:22

arbitrarily turn it off

20:25

let's call them up and and and certainly

20:28

my

20:28

where i live the town um

20:32

i was very impressed with my small

20:33

town's ability to

20:35

hold folks feet to the fire and get

20:38

power restored for us

20:39

because it didn't need to be out um but

20:42

the other thing that i know has worked

20:44

in the past for some of our clients is

20:45

to call the power company and say hey

20:47

i know you have all these places powers

20:50

out i got a kiddo that's dependent upon

20:52

this power

20:53

to breathe and i've only got a generator

20:56

that's gonna you know a couple hours

20:57

maybe three four hours can you restore

20:59

our power first

21:01

versus like the street over um and so

21:04

that's

21:05

you know accommodations in that realm

21:07

right i mean

21:08

it's not something that i necessarily

21:10

ever thought of but it

21:12

it is something that's relatively yeah i

21:15

think we're going to see that more and

21:16

more moving forward

21:17

depending on how things go with the

21:19

infrastructure

21:22

and i think this is stephanie with any

21:23

disaster you're going to have the same

21:25

issues

21:26

you know consumer issues fraud identity

21:29

thefts um

21:30

if you're displaced from a home it's

21:32

going to be continuity of services

21:33

whether it's

21:34

education for your children health care

21:36

services

21:38

um even employment issues so

21:41

there's you know it doesn't stop at one

21:44

substantive legal area

21:45

and depending on the disaster and how it

21:48

impacts community

21:49

you know physically can determine what

21:52

the cases are going to look like as well

21:57

 interesting you mentioned that

21:58

one of the things that we're going to

21:59

add and it should be there by the end of

22:01

this month or maybe next month

22:02

on the blog of the texas disaster lega

22:04

help is

22:06

a discussion of what's called the life

22:07

cycle of disaster recovery where as you

22:09

mentioned you know in the beginning

22:11

i mean depending on the disaster and

22:12

what's involved in your mind just

22:14

housing

22:14

female opinions then you go into the

22:16

next level the consumer issues you know

22:18

where maybe some repairs are not done

22:20

you've got to deal with those matters

22:21

like right now plumbing i'm sure all

22:22

over the

22:23

texas you know and having to even have

22:25

an access for that and then i'm going to

22:26

absolutely do that you know that that's

22:28

going to create some consumer issues

22:30

uh and then you know bankruptcy about

22:32

down the line you know and

22:33

we're going to post about how that

22:35

happens in every disaster

22:37

um  i'm assuming you all see that

22:39

too with your clients or you have a

22:41

client come in with an immediate need

22:42

for maybe

22:42

just housing and then later on it

22:44

becomes a consumer me later on because

22:45

of

22:46

something else along the line you see

22:48

that happening in your cases

22:51

all the time in particular you know i

22:53

mean

22:55

i think the biggest thing that we're

22:56

going to see long term is that consumer

22:58

piece of it

22:59

because you know especially for most of

23:02

our clients on limited income

23:04

um these disasters whether it's a

23:06

natural disaster

23:08

like like a hurricane or whether it's

23:10

covid or whether it's a

23:11

you know an issue with infrastructure um

23:14

our clients don't have you know there's

23:16

a very finite amount of money our

23:18

clients have

23:19

and if they're having to expend like

23:21

let's say you got to pay rent you're

23:22

got to go find a hotel for two nights

23:24

that clean that's done

23:25

and so then what happens you know what

23:27

other bills can't you pay

23:29

and and at that point it it spirals

23:32

right because

23:33

you know are you gonna get medical care

23:36

because you know can you afford it are

23:37

you

23:38

um able to pay for

23:42

you know whatever else it is whether

23:43

it's housing or whether it is

23:45

um food right and so it spirals into

23:48

things and that'll affect you long term

23:50

right your ability

23:51

to get a loan right what if you need

23:53

another car or things like that and so

23:55

it will

23:56

follow you forever and we're

23:59

certainly we're looking at ways to

24:02

address those issues in particular the

24:04

debt

24:04

side of it and

24:08

this is stephanie you know long-term

24:10

recovery i still have

24:12

a handful of clients waiting on harvey

24:15

recovery

24:16

and you know so they're still in homes

24:19

that are not

24:20

really habitable and they've experienced

24:22

covid on top of it now we've had uri

24:24

it's caused more damage

24:26

so that long-term recovery process can

24:29

literally take

24:30

decades to truly recover so

24:33

you know and it's just exacerbated as

24:35

more and more disasters happen

24:37

and then you know the infrastructure

24:39

thing is huge because

24:41

now especially being home in the covid

24:43

environment you know cyber security

24:45

threats are all over the place

24:47

so that just is going to compound you

24:49

know the consumer issues and identity

24:52

theft and all that as well so it's just

24:54

it's it's a whole new world to think

24:56

about all the things that

24:57

could happen and what we should be doing

25:00

to prepare

25:01

for the next time so

25:04

you know it it occurs to me the other

25:06

thing that that we could you know that

25:08

pro bono attorneys could potentially do

25:10

is is some of this

25:11

some of these issues around debt and

25:13

resolving debt issues

25:15

we've started addressing debt issues as

25:18

accommodation issues particularly when

25:19

they revolve around disability pieces so

25:22

you know whether it's you can't pay

25:23

whatever this is because

25:25

you had to have this medication or

25:27

because you had to have transportation

25:29

to this medical

25:30

appointment or things like that that we

25:32

see all the time but we've never

25:34

thought about it in this context before

25:36

until you know last

25:37

few months and so addressing those

25:40

issues

25:41

as an accommodation right um

25:44

you've got housing providers right now

25:46

that even though

25:48

the evictions are on hold they have sent

25:50

the debt to collectors

25:51

already um we have been resolving those

25:54

very

25:54

i don't want to say easily but certainly

25:57

those are cases that can be resolved

25:59

pretty easily because the

26:00

the corporations that hold that debt

26:02

especially right now there's only a

26:03

couple of them

26:05

and they don't want to deal with the

26:07

fair housing claim either

26:09

so those cases are pretty easy to

26:10

resolve and i think that's certainly

26:12

something that pro bono attorney could

26:13

do

26:13

as well maybe i want to be a little

26:16

selfish here

26:17

but i have a lot of clients with that

26:19

situation so could you elaborate on that

26:20

for just like a minute

26:22

like just 60 seconds like what do you

26:24

mean they're easy to resolve because now

26:26

i'm i'm i'm selfishly interested

26:28

selfishly but for my clients

26:30

so so we have um and you know we've done

26:34

in a number of these

26:35

where um if it's with the debt collector

26:39

right and it's let's say we're asking

26:41

for an accommodation let my client pay

26:42

out their rent for a while

26:44

right um and the landlord has already

26:46

sent it over to a debt collector

26:48

we send a letter to the landlord

26:51

engaging with them if

26:53

client hasn't already done that right

26:55

and then we send a letter to

26:57

debt collector and there's generally

26:58

only a couple in terms of housing

27:01

and we say hey we know you're not aware

27:05

however the debt that you're trying to

27:07

collect is

27:08

you know there's there's a question

27:11

around

27:11

because there was an accommodation

27:12

request this debt should not be owed

27:15

under the fair housing act and so you

27:18

know please

27:18

stop trying to collect until this fair

27:21

housing issue is resolved and they

27:24

come back to you um and boy it stops

27:27

them in their tracks

27:30

um quickly that's really cool thank you

27:35

i was actually looking at yall's website

27:36

uh at disabilityrightstx.org and you

27:40

actually have i think those on the

27:41

resources some of those letters or

27:43

samples that i didn't realize for

27:44

housing and other issues

27:46

yeah so what we've done is we have taken

27:49

a lot of the letters that we were

27:51

writing and helping clients write a lot

27:53

and we have done generators with them

27:54

online

27:55

so that clients can input the

27:57

information

27:59

um and ask for them you know and ask for

28:01

these

28:02

accommodations themselves and so the

28:04

reason i say you know these would likely

28:06

be real easy for attorneys to handle is

28:08

because the client

28:09

has likely already made the request

28:11

right and and so the

28:14

generally with the attorney would

28:15

generally do what we've been doing is

28:17

client has already asked and it's it's

28:19

all in writing and they have a record

28:21

because that's

28:22

we designed the form so that people

28:23

could download these

28:25

like the letters to their phone and then

28:26

email it to the landlord from their

28:28

phone

28:28

is the way it was designed um and so

28:32

all the landlord or although the

28:34

attorney would have to do is figure out

28:35

who owns the corporation because the

28:37

client's generally just going to send it

28:38

to the manager

28:39

right manager don't know what the hell

28:40

they're doing um

28:42

and so at that point you know attorney

28:45

gets involved with their letterhead

28:46

sends it to whoever owns it and says do

28:48

you really want to deal with me

28:51

um and the answer is generally no um

28:54

but thank you you know we appreciate

28:56

talking with you goodbye

28:58

uh my dog's name is jessica by the way

29:04

it seems always want to be part of this

29:06

podcast you don't understand almost

29:08

everyone you have one appear or

29:09

sound in the background it's only audio

29:11

but we have a lot of that but this is

29:13

basically a dog podcast now

29:14

it's all it is we just happen to be

29:17

their guests

29:18

either dogs or kids or both well there

29:21

was a six-year-old you heard too

29:23

let me mention the website again because

29:25

i think it's important for the

29:26

volunteers it's disability rights

29:28

tx dot org it's very handy usually we

29:31

actually

29:32

promised our pro bonos to look at our

29:34

website and then we'll put some links in

29:36

there free but y'all done all the work

29:37

for us this is what we like you all are

29:38

the best speakers because you come

29:40

prepared and then

29:41

with the resources we can use and

29:42

honestly uh

29:44

the best sort of pro bono resource for

29:46

the volunteers which you have in the

29:47

website you can actually create a bit of

29:49

a letter a bank of letters now

29:51

to assist your clients and learn that

29:53

practice of the area of law

29:54

by the samples that you put in there and

29:56

how to generate those letters so

29:58

thank you all for sharing this

30:01

so uh we've

30:04

said the word accommodation like a

30:06

thousand times but

30:07

for the folks who aren't so say

30:11

i mean we're going to get a lot of pro

30:12

bono attorneys who have never done

30:13

anything disability related so

30:15

can we do you do like 4000 foot

30:17

explanation of what a reasonable

30:18

accommodation request

30:20

is and like maybe some short we've

30:22

already run through a few examples which

30:24

have been great but

30:25

a a few like quick stories of how

30:27

they've

30:28

how you've employed them and how they've

30:30

worked

30:31

so you know accommodation is a change in

30:35

a policy

30:36

right or a procedure or you know

30:39

something that the landlord or property

30:41

owner or whomever

30:42

right whether it's a you know

30:44

accommodation under the

30:45

americans with disabilities act to um

30:49

you know a state government or a

30:50

governmental entity

30:52

um it's just a change to a policy or

30:54

procedure or the way they do things

30:56

and so um something like

31:00

uh you know one that you know you

31:04

you see or you know people i guess

31:07

understand a little bit more as okay i'm

31:09

personal with the mobility impairment i

31:11

have a hard time walking and my

31:14

i need a parking spot that's assigned to

31:16

me that's very close to my apartment so

31:18

i can get in and out of my apartment

31:20

you know without having to walk very far

31:22

and so they assign you a parking spot

31:24

right there's a pretty you know easy

31:26

example of

31:27

kind of a routine example if you will

31:30

um or um

31:35

yeah i think that's probably the one

31:36

that people

31:38

see the most well yeah see the most

31:41

just uh for the

31:44

listeners to understand that the

31:46

reasonable accommodation request that's

31:48

based in the ada right it's so that's

31:51

it's in a couple of places there's

31:53

um part of there's some of it in the

31:55

americans with disabilities act and

31:56

you know two and title three um and

32:00

Title one there there's also in the

32:02

fair housing act there's no reasonable

32:03

accommodation piece

32:05

and also there's an accommodation uh or

32:08

modification i guess

32:10

some some places use one term over the

32:12

other but it's

32:13

you know some in some places it's very

32:15

similar um

32:16

and then section 504 of the rehab act is

32:19

where you see it

32:20

so there's there's a bunch of different

32:22

places and there's also provisions

32:24

in state law for it for accommodations

32:26

as well

32:27

um and so it draws from a bunch of

32:30

different sources

32:32

um but it depending on

32:35

what situation you're in will depend on

32:37

which law you use some of it is overlap

32:40

but yeah that's where it comes from

32:43

stephanie yeah

32:44

oh sorry i was do you have any instances

32:47

of like of like most common

32:49

like the one that i see the most as a

32:51

tenants rights guy

32:52

is uh a lot of landlords don't

32:56

understand that

32:56

disability either can get paid on the

32:59

third of the month

33:00

or depending on what benefit you get i

33:01

know you're you're laughing right but

33:03

it's see

33:03

it's super common uh that they don't

33:05

know that they can get disability

33:07

disability gets paid on the third or

33:08

certain other benefits get paid on the

33:09

15th and so

33:11

the lease says the first and they start

33:12

tacking on attorneys or not attorney’s fees

33:15

late fees or start filing evictions or

33:17

whatever i'm just like hold on a second

33:18

hold on a second

33:19

here's my request um but you go ahead

33:22

do you have any like common request

33:24

that's the one i do the most is that

33:25

that's my personal story but what about

33:27

you

33:27

right and and you know rachel's our fair

33:30

housing person but that i mean that

33:31

reasonable accommodation is as simple as

33:33

extending the time i mean so

33:36

but you know and a lot of stuff that i

33:39

deal with now is more

33:40

federal and fema and ensuring

33:44

effective communication too under

33:45

section 508 of rehab act

33:47

so it's knowing what your client needs

33:51

based on their disability

33:52

one of the biggest issues with fema

33:54

right now is their habitability standard

33:57

and a client is not going to know to ask

34:00

as a reasonable accommodation i need a

34:02

modification to fema's habitability

34:04

standard

34:04

it took me forever to figure that out

34:06

and how to put it in magic words

34:08

so it's it's knowing what the client

34:11

needs and how to get it and sometimes

34:13

you have to think outside of the box

34:15

and be creative and sometimes you can

34:17

wave it around at somebody say hey you

34:18

need to do this and they're going to do

34:20

it but other times it

34:21

is a systemic issue that is going to

34:23

take us a long time to change that

34:24

process but

34:25

accommodations in and of themselves like

34:28

i say can be as easy as extending a

34:29

timeline

34:31

um changing the policy you know another

34:33

thing in direct housing under fema's

34:35

they have these

34:36

recertification meetings if you're in a

34:39

direct housing unit

34:41

and after harvey there was no affordable

34:44

housing right everybody was scrambling

34:46

trying to figure out but fema has

34:48

this process where they have these

34:49

meetings in place every two weeks

34:52

well for someone that's waiting on

34:54

public housing to become available

34:56

with a mental illness just exacerbates

35:00

their disability so asking for

35:03

less meetings is a simple accommodation

35:06

that could be provided

35:07

if they've already worked towards

35:08

insuring their permanent housing and if

35:10

they're just waiting on a voucher

35:12

you know that's as simple as saying okay

35:14

we'll meet once a month versus every two

35:16

weeks or every four weeks or whatever it

35:18

is

35:18

so

35:22

and i'd like to point out to our pro

35:24

bono volunteers

35:25

there's been a wealth of information so

35:27

far and we're not even

35:28

done with the podcast but we're not

35:31

expecting you

35:32

to be 100% familiar with the ada or hud

35:36

regulations

35:37

um i've been a disaster attorney for

35:39

several years now

35:40

i'm not even familiar with every aspect

35:44

of those policies so you can come to us

35:46

if you're not

35:47

sure if an accommodation should be made

35:51

for example extending the written

35:52

deadline if you're a brand new attorney

35:55

or have never done any housing cases

35:58

you might not understand that legally

35:59

they do have to make that accommodation

36:01

so ask us we're always here i know

36:05

stephanie's here rachel's here stuart

36:07

myself

36:09

we do have mentors on the website we

36:11

have a variety of resources we have live

36:13

chat

36:14

uh just ask us and just in addition to

36:17

that

36:18

we've actually also talked about the

36:19

systemic and institutionalized

36:21

discrimination

36:22

that exists for disabled people we're

36:25

not going to give you one of those cases

36:26

that has to be taken off to the texas

36:28

appeal

36:28

unless you really want it but then all

36:30

means but

36:32

you're probably going to get some of the

36:34

quicker cases that

36:36

we just um i hate to say don't have time

36:38

for them it's just

36:40

there are too many cases there are

36:42

millions of cases out there that qualify

36:44

for our services that we just can't

36:45

take and that's kind of why we need you

36:47

if you can show up an eviction hearing

36:49

and just say

36:50

no this falls under the moratorium order

36:53

or no this falls under

36:54

fair debt collection practices and get

36:56

that dismissed

36:57

you've made a huge difference in that

36:59

person's life for

37:01

maybe a few hours worth of work and have

37:03

taken a client that would have not

37:05

gotten services otherwise

37:08

i also want to remind folks might not

37:10

remember this or know about this

37:12

and maybe folks you don't know either if

37:15

you take on a case of

37:16

first impression you're learning maybe

37:17

an area of law you can actually get up

37:19

to five hours of cle for doing that pro

37:21

bono case as a volunteer

37:24

one of us rachel or stephanie here do

37:26

the mentoring they can get five hours of

37:28

cle for mentoring

37:29

the mentee gets five hours too that's

37:30

one third of your CLE requirement i

37:32

know

37:32

isn't that great that you can also get

37:34

both ways did ya’ll just found out about that

37:36

Rachel stephanie

37:37

instead of me no you know i i didn't

37:40

know

37:40

you know stephanie you and i how many

37:42

hours do we have i know right

37:46

if i had a visual you'd see like the

37:48

more you know graphic just come out you

37:50

know across the screen

37:51

i could do that so yes i mean for

37:53

volunteers and for you all that really

37:54

does matter and

37:55

if you don't know how to get in that

37:57

credit just let us know i can give you

37:58

the information

38:05

and rachel and stephanie are thinking

38:06

they will never ever have to take a cle

38:08

class ever again

38:11

effectively yeah

38:16

there's one of the things that

38:20

that we have found in terms of you know

38:25

policies and procedures is that

38:28

it's a different way of looking at

38:30

things 

38:32

um

38:33

and so i come initially out of legal aid

38:37

i worked for legal aid in oklahoma before

38:38

we moved back to texas

38:40

um and it wasn't until i got to

38:44

disability rights texas and really got

38:46

my hands dirty if you will and really

38:48

got into a lot of

38:50

the cases that were being done here that

38:53

i really

38:53

put together a lot of the things that i

38:56

had learned in legal aid and the cases

38:57

that i'd handled whether it was family

38:59

law or

39:00

whether it was you know

39:03

an unemployment hearing or um evictions

39:06

and housing discrimination those kinds

39:07

of things

39:08

um and then you you look at it with the

39:10

overlay of disability

39:12

nine times out of ten i would say

39:14

looking back there was a disability

39:16

impact or disability implication on my

39:19

cases and i just didn't realize it

39:22

um because it

39:25

nobody no i mean you really don't want

39:26

to say nobody knows but

39:28

the reality is this is it's not knit

39:30

it's not you know

39:32

there's just not a lot of information

39:35

out there

39:36

and so um you know if it comes up in

39:40

you know in somebody's conversation with

39:42

the pro bono attorney with your client

39:44

if disability comes up in any way reach

39:46

out to one of us

39:47

because you're never going to be there

39:49

um and

39:51

not that we throw things at the wall

39:52

sometimes we do

39:54

um a lot of times it sticks

39:57

and you know uh so

40:01

that's why i have many increments of

40:04

five hours i think we should have but it

40:06

is what it is

40:11

all right are there like any specific

40:13

examples you can think of that you know

40:15

because i can think of a few you know

40:17

back

40:18

doing this for 20 years and then you

40:20

know doing a few of the uh

40:22

ada cases that i did later on in life i

40:25

in my career i realized wait a minute

40:26

you know what i could probably talk to

40:27

my client who had the adhd

40:30

you know son in a custody battle to

40:31

maybe get them some assistance to be

40:33

able to

40:34

you know however just kind of both move

40:36

forward through that you know

40:37

i didn't think about those issues i just

40:39

thought about the legal problem in front

40:40

of me let's get them custody and move

40:42

on and never something more that would

40:44

have helped and what helped for us at

40:45

trla

40:47

and i think you all done this too is

40:48

that we have now these uh

40:51

we have uh social workers at our

40:53

organizations you know who actually sit

40:55

down and talk to some of our clients and

40:56

they identify things

40:57

we wouldn't see otherwise because

40:59

otherwise like most legal aid attorneys

41:01

we're doing both things you know

41:02

attorney and social worker at times

41:05

you don't have any examples you can

41:07

think of that maybe you know what

41:08

that would have been a great time or

41:09

maybe i did apply something i know here

41:11

from my disability rights knowledge

41:16

i mean it happens so often you know i

41:18

mean anything i you know

41:20

if you're on social media at all and you

41:22

see people talking about stuff right now

41:24

what we're starting to hear about is

41:25

mold

41:27

you know but pipes are busted mold we're

41:30

starting to hear it already

41:31

it started to you know when when the

41:33

temperatures

41:34

went back up we started to hear it and

41:37

so what you hear about or what you see

41:39

is generally people talking about mold

41:41

and i can't live here anymore i want to

41:42

move what they may not say outright

41:46

is that i can't breathe i'm coughing all

41:50

the time

41:51

my my son or daughter is turning red

41:54

right they've got rash that's broke out

41:56

all over the hives that they didn't have

41:58

before

42:00

and it's those things you know that's

42:03

a big one that we're seeing right now

42:04

that you know i before i started doing

42:06

this i don't know that i would have ever

42:07

picked up on

42:09

on those kinds of issues

42:13

um or the implications of that it's not

42:15

just a habitability issue it's a it's a

42:17

you know it's an accommodation issue

42:19

right let me out on my lease

42:21

or remediate this you know bring some

42:23

bring the professionals in

42:24

to do this or if it's some kind of

42:26

public housing move me to another unit

42:28

or give me a voucher

42:31

so this is stephanie i i just

42:35

i'm a newbie attorney still i had a

42:37

15-year career

42:38

in special education so i was built

42:42

well-versed in providing accommodations

42:44

for students

42:45

you know and as an educator scaffolding

42:47

things accommodating things so

42:49

i had that piece but then of course i

42:52

had to

42:53

understand the rule of law and where all

42:54

that plays in but i think the bottom

42:55

line is just

42:57

if something doesn't feel right for

42:58

somebody and it's not fair

43:01

there's probably something else that you

43:03

could be done whether it's reasonable

43:04

accommodation process or figuring out it

43:06

just

43:06

and it comes back to what that

43:08

individual needs at that point in time

43:10

and i think

43:11

you know especially being able to be an

43:13

ejw fellow and disaster lawyer

43:17

we have this network and it's not just

43:20

case services it's community ordering

43:22

and knowing those resources in the

43:24

community

43:24

and building that partnership with

43:26

stakeholders for me it's with disability

43:28

organizations as well as disaster

43:30

organizations

43:31

through local voads and stuff like that

43:33

so it's it's knowing your resources as

43:36

well as an attorney

43:37

and being able to advocate for your

43:38

client and what they need

43:46

43:49

so you know i just thought about this

43:51

right now because i've got a fourth

43:52

grader here and a second grader at home

43:54

you can probably hear in the background

43:56

the spring break noises but i realized

43:59

something

43:59

we were recently uh at a park here with

44:02

my fourth grader and a little bit of a

44:03

crowd gathered around you know people

44:05

were around and i saw her just kind of

44:06

panic and get most anxiety attack you

44:08

know just from that feeling i'm like you

44:09

know we're fine six feet away we're

44:11

outside

44:12

and i'm wondering you know when they've

44:13

got to go back to school there's this

44:15

group of kids that are gonna have to go

44:16

back now

44:17

after a full year of not being around

44:19

the cdc just put out i think regulation

44:21

today of

44:22

three feet of space instead of six feet

44:24

and i'm wondering though

44:25

if that's practitioners you have to stop

44:27

and realize maybe educational

44:29

uh accommodation issues they're gonna

44:30

come up you know with our kids who

44:32

probably haven't been in school in a

44:33

while and they're gonna start being

44:35

fleeing those stressors you think that's

44:37

something

44:38

you've seen might come up or might have

44:41

to identify

44:42

oh yeah so i have a my my six-year-old

44:46

has been so she went back to school

44:50

um i mean there was no way she could

44:53

stay home and stuff

44:54

stephanie as a former educator walked

44:57

through this with me quite substantially

44:59

um but she was not doing well at home

45:03

um there is a reason i am not a teacher

45:05

i am not an educator

45:06

um my husband is but they were back in

45:09

school

45:10

um so she went back and

45:15

you know most texas classrooms six feet

45:17

is not gonna happen

45:19

it's three feet right effectively is

45:21

what

45:22

she's been in now they've been masking

45:24

and um

45:25

you know there are machines in that room

45:27

to to do what they can to scrub the air

45:29

and things like that

45:31

um but even then

45:34

right because we haven't been you know

45:36

we've not been to shul we've not been to

45:38

sunday school we've not been to you know

45:40

all of these things that we normally do

45:43

she she's always been sensitive to noise

45:46

but it is even more so now than i have

45:49

ever seen her sensitive to noise before

45:52

um like i went in to wake her up the

45:54

other morning

45:55

and was singing she flipped she started

45:57

crying

45:59

um so i think we and and i know that

46:01

that has manifested in the classroom too

46:03

i mean i've talked to the teacher and

46:04

marsha's had problems in this in the

46:05

classroom with things being loud

46:08

and god love her teacher is a saint who

46:10

you know

46:11

yeah sometimes i got you know things get

46:12

a little loud

46:14

um or we have to make a point and think

46:16

you know and so

46:17

i do think it's gonna happen because

46:19

she's you know she wasn't in school for

46:21

quite some time

46:22

but she's been back in school

46:25

um and so for kids that haven't been i

46:27

think it's going to be even more of an

46:30

adjustment

46:33

that's a very good point we could almost

46:34

do a complete other episode

46:37

on trauma from disasters and then

46:39

education 504s and idea

46:41

and stephanie has handled those cases

46:43

before so if there are pro bono

46:44

attorneys that want to do that

46:46

um and that want that that's a you know

46:49

certainly

46:50

that is something that stephanie has

46:51

experience on from both sides of it

46:53

right

46:54

um and so she is a fantastic resource

46:56

i'm trying to get you to CLE

46:58

hours

47:00

can you tell us what the 504 references

47:02

that belinda mentioned because i know

47:03

some of us

47:03

those of us here legally might know

47:05

maybe practitioners might want to know

47:06

about that

47:07

so an education for and and i have to

47:11

say this as far as

47:12

disasters you know kids are pretty damn

47:14

resilient i mean

47:16

going back to school is going to be

47:18

overwhelming for everyone

47:19

including the teachers when they have

47:20

them all back in the classroom

47:22

but it's being able and teachers

47:25

innately

47:26

scaffold and modify and accommodate for

47:28

all kids anyways but

47:30

it's going to be those that don't bounce

47:32

back to normal at some point that are

47:34

going to need

47:35

those supports whether it's through

47:37

section 504

47:39

or special education under idea so

47:42

and those are just certain programs that

47:45

help with providing a free and

47:47

appropriate public education for any

47:49

student

47:50

that needs it in the classroom

47:55

i mean it's going to be interesting also

47:56

that you're out of teachers bus drivers

47:58

cafeteria workers you know

47:59

all these folks that have to be

48:01

definitely i would have put them in the

48:02

1b

48:03

selection you know vaccinations just

48:04

because people are opening up schools

48:06

and places and

48:07

they have to be in front of them we had

48:09

a discussion here in our district and

48:10

this might be on the discussion it's

48:12

like

48:12

um do we want to have children return

48:14

back to school like nope yeah

48:16

sure kids are not going to be as

48:17

susceptible to gaps you know getting

48:19

this disease but what about the teachers

48:20

and it was great to see the teachers

48:22

come up and remind folks that you know

48:23

there's a lot more involved here than

48:25

just your kids when you come into school

48:27

and uh it'd be good for the

48:28

practitioners enough for us to legal

48:29

services start identifying those issues

48:31

and seeing them

48:31

you know like right now for example

48:33

something people don't know about they

48:34

were getting a ton of our probate

48:36

matters because after every covid spike

48:38

there are deaths that we might provide

48:39

probate matters there's these things

48:41

we're identifying as we're learning

48:42

through the recovery of this giant

48:44

disaster

48:45

and then exacerbated by others that

48:46

we're having to kind of

48:48

move forward through and then you know

48:49

you know have the pro bono help us with

48:51

the volume and i see those educational

48:52

issues probably come up

48:54

if not at the end of the school year and

48:56

a couple of months maybe definitely in

48:57

august when the school year starts

48:59

along with custody issues and other

49:01

matters are going to pop up when the

49:02

courts open up

49:04

well and that's going to be another

49:05

interesting and

49:07

and i think that this is going to come

49:08

up as a practitioner and

49:12

things are you know i'm not in court

49:14

every day like i was when i was in

49:15

private practice in central texas

49:17

you know years and years ago but you

49:20

know having had that experience of being

49:21

in court every day

49:22

and

49:26

one of the things that's going to be

49:27

very interesting in terms of long-term

49:29

disaster with covid is that we've got a

49:31

lot of long haulers

49:32

out there right now so you know

49:35

friends of mine and you know family

49:37

members that have had it that still have

49:39

symptoms you know six months a year

49:40

later

49:42

right and so what happens when that

49:44

person can't go into court physically

49:47

does the court still do virtual for for

49:49

the client

49:50

right that's an accommodation request to

49:52

the court that the court ought to grant

49:53

right i mean we know how to do that now

49:55

we've all shown that um

49:58

you know other things are if you've got

50:00

a vulnerable population somebody can't

50:02

get the vaccine

50:04

um and so what do you do at that point

50:06

right

50:07

um and so you're gonna see

50:09

accommodations pop up in every

50:11

you know almost everywhere you are um

50:16

obviously you already do but i think

50:17

it's going to be even more prevalent

50:20

not just after you know not just with

50:22

natural disasters i think it's going to

50:24

be everywhere

50:25

across the state whereas you know i'm up

50:27

in north texas we really don't

50:28

you know we've got the tornadoes but

50:30

they're not anything like a hurricane

50:33

you know in terms of

50:36

you know just the amount of damage and

50:38

and upheaval and stuff and so i think

50:40

that that's something

50:41

that we're not necessarily used to but

50:43

with covet i think that

50:45

we're going to see a lot more of that so

50:48

i

50:49

pablo i see we're almost out of time but

50:51

i was thinking maybe

50:52

maybe if we can go over just a minute or

50:54

two i i want

50:56

both i want both of our guests to give

50:59

us a story that stands out to you if you

51:01

can

51:02

uh of course if you if you can that's

51:05

fine but

51:06

um it stands out to you where you're

51:09

able to help someone

51:10

uh with a disability in a disaster

51:12

setting one of them that like really

51:13

stands out to you is something that

51:15

we would get our our our listeners our

51:17

volunteers involved

51:19

um i'm kind of putting you on the spot

51:22

right and i know

51:22

a few you or maybe you didn't expect

51:25

this question but

51:26

if you can share a story that where it

51:28

was particularly impactful to you as an

51:30

attorney

51:31

um uh or maybe to the community as a

51:34

whole

51:34

or both uh where someone that you helped

51:37

was

51:38

was uh or someone had a significant

51:41

change in their life because of

51:42

your assistance

51:45

whoever can take it first rachel you

51:48

want to go first

51:49

sure so um

51:52

we've had a number of cases where

51:56

people's lives have been upended right

51:58

recently one of you know some of the

52:00

bigger ones that we have seen

52:02

are we've got clients who end up in a

52:05

hospital

52:06

on a ventilator um and some of them come

52:09

out and some of them do not

52:12

um but what we have seen again and again

52:16

is landlords trying to charge people

52:19

to end a lease you come out of the

52:20

hospital you can't go back home

52:22

right you've been on an event you need

52:24

to go either to family member's house or

52:25

you need to go to rehab you gotta

52:27

be able to terminate the lease and

52:30

and go deal with your you know your

52:32

health right you can't be worrying about

52:34

thousands of dollars tens of thousands

52:36

of dollars this landlord wants to charge

52:37

you

52:38

when you're just trying to live um and

52:41

so we have been able to in a number of

52:43

instances and

52:43

engage in cases where

52:47

people have been hospitalized and you

52:49

know they're fighting to survive

52:51

um meanwhile a landlord is trying to

52:53

charge them you know

52:54

five ten thousand dollars um

52:57

and it it that one pulls at your heart

53:00

strings

53:01

right because this could be you know a

53:03

family member

53:04

um and so we've been able you know

53:08

certainly on a number of occasions to

53:09

successfully terminate those leases and

53:11

you know it's one less thing the family

53:13

has to to deal with if somebody does

53:15

you know had you know like in an

53:17

instance where somebody has passed away

53:18

so the family doesn't have to deal with

53:20

that piece of it

53:21

um and so you make an impact on

53:23

somebody's life and

53:24

and what could be the hardest moment

53:26

they're ever to face

53:32

that's awesome yeah i mean that's the

53:34

kind of stuff i hope that

53:35

some of our volunteers can help do too

53:37

stephanie do you have any examples or

53:39

stories you want to share

53:40

yes so i mentioned the habitability

53:43

thing you know one of my first cases

53:45

was a fema appeal for habitability and

53:48

um

53:49

needless to say i didn't win that appeal

53:52

with her

53:53

but i did help her with getting safe

53:56

affordable housing and

53:57

reasonable accommodations through you

53:59

know public housing authority and all

54:00

that kind of stuff but that case

54:02

as an attorney showed me the systemic

54:05

issue that we need to be focusing on

54:08

with fema and while she wasn't the right

54:10

plaintiff

54:11

we've organized to address for future

54:14

disasters with

54:15

other legal aides other disaster

54:17

attorneys hey this is something we need

54:18

to address

54:19

at all levels systemically and then

54:21

combined with

54:23

for our community you know the

54:24

disability community looking at

54:26

inclusive

54:27

emergency preparedness on a long-term

54:30

scale

54:31

fixing those issues at the local level

54:34

at the state level too

54:35

so you know it's it's

54:39

you make a difference for each client

54:41

but sometimes seeing the big picture you

54:43

know takes a long time

54:44

so

54:48

thank you so much stephanie belinda do you

54:49

have anything here to add not

54:53

at this time now listen i don't know

54:56

it's because we recorded this usually

54:57

late in the afternoon or

54:58

later than usual not in the morning but

55:00

it's been a really good season it's so

55:02

good of a podcast that i forgot to

55:04

put the timer on and i just gave you

55:05

like a two minute warning and i

55:07

apologize for that but it really was at

55:09

it

55:09

i really enjoyed it uh thank you all so

55:11

much for the time the input

55:13

you know and the great expertise you all

55:15

provided you all honestly like read the

55:17

past scripts from others you went right

55:20

through the things we needed to cover

55:22

so eliminate you all go here at this

55:24

point and thank you for

55:25

uh taking part in this podcast we're not

55:27

going to stop the recording since we've

55:29

done over an hour but thank you both

55:30

rachel and stephanie oh thank you thank

55:33

you for having us

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